This sucked, What really matters

Now that I have your attention: The flim had great effects, costumes, etc but these things don't make a great film. A great film comes from a good plot and character development, of which this film had neither. The plot was

Gandalf gives exposition
Strider searches for Gollum
Strider finds Gollum
Gandalf spits more exposition

All that comes straight from the books. Throw in some orc, ranger, and elf cameos and we get get 33 minutes of costumes and landscapes. The non-existent plot is emphasized by framing it with overly heavy exposition at the beginning and end.

The fights scenes had no point: Strider and orcs cross paths so of course they have to fight. Really? That's all you could think of? Then Arwen has to make an appearance, right? So let's copy the flim and give Aragorn a near-death experience with an Arwen vision. Nevermind that, unlike the film, there's no explanation of how Strider wakes up in complete health. Oh, and I love the Black Rider who is supposed to be a good hunter, but can't even hear Gollum squealing a few meters away. What's the Nazgul doing creeping in Mirkwood anyway? He should be riding to the Shire at full speed. Then we get a pointless elf scene.

And then there's the lack of character development. If Tolkien had not given these characters great background already, this film would have nothing. Gollum only mutters jibberish. Gandalf only repeats plot points. Strider walks and kills things. Never mind that Gandalf and Strider are good friends. Or that the ranger is Strider's only living family. Or that Gandalf and Gollum go back decades. In FOTR flim, they never meet yet Gandalf has more interesting things to say about him. ("My heart tells me that Gollum has some part to play yet, for good or ill, before this is over.")

There was one good point of character development. Strider rues that Isildur didn't destroy the ring which (I infer) makes him feel responsible and he volunteers to find Gollum. Immediately after we see Strider praying to an ancestor for strength. This is nice in contrast to his inherited shame (at least in the Jackson interpretation). Then we get 30 minutes of eye candy.

The film could have done better. The book leaves an entire 17 years open for interpretation. Gandalf is always alluding to secret errands and missions. He must have done many interesting things in those years. Strider's history, likewise, is left blank here. There are few limitations but THFG limits itself voluntarily. Gollum has an interesting history with Shelob which could have been explored/created. I would have loved to see Gandalf and Strider interrogate Gollum which could have been a great expression of Gollum's character, hearing him describe his Shelob and Mordor experiences which the books and films gloss over. Then there is the mystery that Sauron let Gollum loose. The film could have told us why. Did Sauron arm Gollum with a weapon that would help him find the ring? Did Sauron send spies after Gollum to insure Sauron could retrieve the ring if Gollum found it? Weapons or spies that Strider could justifiably fight? Perhaps Sauron did not let him loose but Gollum escaped and Sauron is hunting him too. Strider could face down this evil hunter. How did Gollum escape the elves (and possibly Mordor)? Is there someone else seeking the ring aiding Gollum. Saruman? Shelob? Tempted powers like Galadriel? Only during this time does Gandalf learn Bilbo's ring is The Ring. The entire Second Age and Isildur could be explored too. There's so much that could have been done. Even just create a subplot. Have Strider rescues some cute babies. Something!

The LOTR was perhaps the most influential book I ever read. I was not moved by action sequences (of which it had little) or special effects or cool magic powers. Yet these are the only things THFG cares about. LOTR is a classic because it inspires wonder and mystery. It echoes the timeless themes of good and evil, the hero's quest, friendship to the ends of the earth, a dying and resurrection god who saves us . . .

Why did you bother to write all of this if, as you say in another post, "TH4G has no rights at all"?

You go on to say in this post "There's so much that could have been done" regarding the plot of TH4G. But if you are so adamant about that first statement re: rights, why bother to opine here regarding plot--or anything else?

Please note: I am NOT part of the TH4G production. Just curious as to why you decided to expend the energy.

My ideas are mutually exclusive. There are two separate ideas:

1 THFG does not follow copyright.
2 THFG has good production value but no heart.

I don't have a problem with violating copyright. I do it myself if the case is justified. But I have a problem with people whining their rights are being trampled on when Tolkien is being fair and could be far worse. If you're going to break copyright, do it well.

I thought it was really good and can't believe you guys did this on such a small budget,

I just had a couple problems and I guess they could be justified in a sense...

The score.

Whoever wrote the score obviously did it with all of Howard Shore's themes in mind. I could hear riffs from his LOTR score everywhere. I'm pretty sure I heard music that could have been semi-inspired by requiem for a dream too (during a fight scene), which was used in the trailer for TTT. I guess it could have been intended to bring in LOTR audiences, but as a composer, it lacked originality. I think you should have come up with something new instead of writing a score that parallels with Howard Shore's work. I just thought it was way too similar.

And the work as a whole, from a filmmakers perspective, it was entirely too New Line LOTR based. I think you guys should have made it so much more original. I thought you guys should have done your own thing. The part where Strider is on the ground and is looking at the little flowers and has a vision of Arwen, reminded me too much of when Frodo was on the ground and sees the flowers and Galadriel. I thought there were too many little things that were taken from New Line's LOTR and changed just a little bit, then put in your movie. I think as filmmakers you guys should have pushed the limit and tried something entirely new in that sense.

Making your movie like that would attract the people who loved LOTR the movie, but I don't know if you guys had that in mind or not. If you did, it worked, but I wish you would have tried to change it up much more. I mean isn't art being original and creative? I thought you guys were a little on the safe side.

Sorry if this is mean. I enjoyed your movie! I thought it was great, but those were the things that kind of got me. Gollum looked great!

I'm really excited about residue!!

I enjoyed the score, both the quality and Howard Shore-ness of it. The filmmakers were obviously aiming to integrate themselves into the Jackson continuity and style - from the casting to the typeface. I don't think there's anything wrong with that and they carried it off brilliantly. It's only the lack of plot and character that bothered me.

Impressive pastiche of the PJ films, but that's the problem I had with it. The more it imitated the original in the voice acting, the handheld camerawork, the framing, the dolly zoom, the editing, the sound design, the art design, the music, and the color timing, the more apparent it was that this is a third-party knock off of the original.

I'd love to see a fresh and original approach to the Tolkien stories, even inferred and interstitial ones such as this. There's obviously too much talent involved here to be spending it on the wannabe bastard son of a film of which there's already more than enough already.

Those who crave any more they can get of PJ's LOTR should be pleased, but I'm just not part of that camp.

Where do you go from here? More imitation?

I actually saw a goof. The part when Aragorn had to kill the two orcs in the woods. When he stabbed the last orc, the other half of the sword was left at the orcs' back. I know that's just prostetic or something but still..

I agree with Ephilei and Bufo.
The film was impressive in its similarity to and seamlessness of style with the lotr films, but even seen as part of the others, it is lacking. Here I am thinking mostly of the characters, their lack of dignity, and also the way the film failed to adjust to its consequence.
This part of the story is important for what it leads to, but it's definitely not the climax and is a sort of interlude. I thought the music was excellent and one of the most important factors in linking it strongly to the other films-- but the music here was similar not only in style, but in scale; the story outlined here to me warrants some sort of downshift in drama and seriousness (in music)! The story is important in the sense of 'this happened, so this happened..'-- but it's not epic the way any of the lotr movies are, because it simply hasn't reached the most important parts yet.
But mostly, it seems pretty clear that the producers of this film took their inspiration from the movies, not the books! Great focus on image, special effects, style of filming, etc etc. (Especially the orcs in the main fighting scene-- they were exactly like those in the other films). But if the producers were coming from a true love of Tolkien (and wanted to make a good film in its own right), it seems that they might have taken on other parts of the story, as Ephilei suggests. At the least, a better understanding and representation of the characters--and a better plot-structure--would have helped, to me, make it more memorable. As it is, the film fits in pretty well with the others, but with none of the others' weightiness, and with very little new dedication to and inspiration from Tolkien.

(Still-- awesome, awesome orcs!)

Wow talk about bitter, and dare I say "nerdy." This film is supposed to be an elaboration on the adventures of the characters which were already established in the books/movies. Be glad to have it, I sure got my Middle Earth fix. I t took some obvious talent, time passion and dedication to get this done on a tiny budget. If you can to better I'd love to see it...