Title: Garth Grenache agrees with Hodeuon that Jehovah Description:has the precise same vowels as Adonay!
daved - April 6, 2009 04:21 PM (GMT)
I though that I'd better post this particular topic today. I have been discussing the vowel points of Jehovah with a friend named Garth Grenache who has his own website.
He believes that Jehovah has the precise same vowel points as does Adonay, however his proof seems to be a little unorthodox to me, but it just may seem correct to Hodeuon.
The conversation went like this text below, on his website.
Dave [To] Garth: I can only answer one of your quesions at this time. You, [Garth,] asked: *Could one say that YHWH *has* indeed been marked with the precise points of Adonay, albeit only some of those points?
[Dave [To] Garth: NO, I personally believe that it would be disingenous for a scholarly source to say something like, "Jehovah has the precise same vowel points as "Adonay" except that the first vowel point in each word is different."
[Garth responds to Dave]: Please note that these are not the words that I have said or would say.
My claim is that the same point marked under the Yod in YHWH is also under the 'aleph in 'adonay: The sh:wa point, marks a reduced vowel in both cases.
The shwa in 'adonay has additional marking which the sh:wa placed in YHWH does not have: it is thus called a 'compound sh:wa' because the patach mark beside it specifies the quality of the reduced vowel.
When the sh:wa occurs without a quality mark, the sh:wa's quality is not marked.
It is not that the sh:wa necessarily has no quality or a different quality, or marks a 'different vowel' from the compound sh:was: rather, the lack of the marking of a simple sh:wa simply means that the vowel's quality hasn't been marked.
My suggestion is not ingenuous or insincere, but reflects the linguistic concept of 'markedness', which is appropriately applied to the case of composite sh:was, which are simply sh:was with additional *quality* marking.
The basic linguistic concept of markedness is that a lack of markings is just that: a lack of specification.
The simple sh:wa doesn't tell us that a different vowel from 'a' is to be pronounced: it tells us NOTHING about the quality of the vowel: it speaks only of the quantity of the vowel: i.e. the vowel is reduced (more correctly, it tells us there is no full vowel after the marked consonant, and hence it also occurs to mark closed syllables).
Generally, the quality of reduced vowels is only marked under gutteral consonants.
Here I suggest the quality is deliberately unmarked, because the quality of the pronounced vowel of 'adonay is the same as the quality of the true vowel of the Name YHWH.